Peter: I'm with another member of the Next Level photography training program, Tom Balazs of Two Twisted Trees. Tom has an amazing story, and I'm excited to get into the results he's had working with us over the last couple of months. Tom, introduce yourself.

Tom: I'm Tom Balazs, and I own Two Twisted Trees Photography. I'm based in Northern Michigan. There are two parts of Michigan, the lower peninsula and the U.P., and I'm way up here on the pinky. I've been doing photography professionally for nine years, and the last couple of months working with Peter have really changed my plan.

Peter: You had a full-time job until recently, right? What were you doing?

Tom: I moved to Michigan from California a week before my wedding, nine years ago. Leaving California was really the start of my photography career. I decided I was going to change my life and do photography full-time. That was the hope. But moving to a new state, I didn't know what the challenges or opportunities would look like. To make ends meet for the first couple of months, I took a job at a winery, my favorite in the area.

There's a big wine industry up here, and it sucked me in. I wanted to learn more and more about winemaking, growing grapes, tasting wines, breaking down flavor profiles and pairing with food. I could go on for days. It became a major distraction from growing my photography business, which I still did. I did about equal parts wine and photography, and I got to a point where I couldn't progress in either career. I'd reached plateaus on both ends, stretched myself super thin, and I wasn't happy with either job. When COVID hit, the winery was closed for about six weeks, and that gave me a speck of hope. It showed me what life could be like with a single job, doing what I wanted, which is photography. I'd originally planned to leave the winery this year, but with COVID and all my weddings moved to next year, I was hesitant. Then I took a leap of faith after talking to Peter and seeing the potential of the program, and honestly, I haven't looked back. There hasn't been a single day where I've worried or wished I was still doing two jobs.

Peter: You said something interesting: to really progress in one, you had to cut out the other entirely. That's hard for a lot of people.

Tom: It's scary, because it leaves you with a lot of unknowns. At one point I'd climbed the ladder at the winery and was managing the tasting room and the wine club, while still running my photography business and shooting about 15 weddings in the summer. As a manager, you're expected to be there on Saturdays. They knew going in that I'd still be shooting, but it made everything much more stressful, putting full energy into photography on weekdays and then switching to the other job. It's too much back and forth, and your brain has a hard time adjusting.

Peter: Your focus is split. There's only so much energy, and it's getting channeled into two things.

Peter: How did you first come across me?

Tom: I think it was a sponsored post on Facebook. I clicked your link, checked out your website, left that page open for about a week, and decided to wait. This was right during quarantine. Then I saw another post of yours that featured a photographer I knew who was going through your program. So I looked into you more, and after talking with someone on your team and with you, and getting an idea of how everything would work, I was sold.

Peter: What piqued your interest in the beginning?

Tom: It sounded like you were talking right to me. I think your ad said something like how to book $20,000 in weddings during COVID. Which is exactly what we did. That, and I watched one of your sample videos on your website, and it made me want to know more.

Peter: So you've had a photography business for years, but it was always part-time while you worked at the winery. You always knew you wanted to do photography full-time.

Tom: I just didn't know how to get there. I kept the winery as a safety net, for stable income.

Peter: What was the real challenge when we first started talking?

Tom: Time management, honestly, especially working two jobs, with photo shoots that weren't weddings popping up during the week. But closing sales was also becoming a problem. I wasn't having as good a success rate as I used to. And I wanted more confidence in my understanding of business. Not many photographers I know have business degrees. We're photographers first and business second.

Peter: It's very common, because there's so much emphasis on the craft. Very often it's not the craft that needs work. If you put all your effort into that, the other side doesn't get as much attention.

Tom: Marketing on social media is another big struggle of mine. So I'd say those three: time, sales and getting leads.

Peter: Where was your business at, revenue-wise, when we started talking?

Tom: I had about $30,000 in bookings for this year that got moved to next year. At that time, I think I was at about $19,000 for 2020. That was back in June or July, I think. Probably around $20,000-something.

Peter: Were you feeling like this year might be a lost cause?

Tom: I was afraid I wouldn't be able to pay my quarterly taxes. I applied for a couple of grants and actually got one. I was kind of freaking out. That's why I thought there was no way I could quit my other job, because I was worried about having enough to pay my taxes and cover the cost of living. I thought, if I can just get through this year, I'll be good.

Peter: So why did you quit your job in the middle of COVID?

Tom: Like I said, it was a huge leap of faith. But the way wineries, restaurants and breweries have had to adapt their business, I wasn't interested in being part of it anymore. I'd been there nine years, and I was mentally checked out. I wasn't really interfacing with customers anymore, I was more on the back end, but it was still just enough of a job to be a nuisance, taking me away from my photography business. The one line that kept running through my head was, "If there is one year of my life that I really need to fight for my business, it's this year." And wasn't I right? If I didn't do everything I could right now to grow my business and get through this year, it was never going to happen. So I decided, I'm done. We're going to do this. I'm going to sign up with Peter, he's going to help me, and the investment is going to pay back many times over. I haven't looked back.

Peter: You burned the boats. Sometimes you have to dive in and make it work.

Tom: There are a lot of small, family-owned businesses up here. What I noticed during the shutdown and after reopening was that the businesses that sat around waiting for something to save them aren't doing well or had to close. The ones that adapted, flipped their tables over and did everything they could to adjust are still successful today.

Peter: In every crisis, there are opportunities. Some people rise to the occasion and turn it into something positive, and some businesses cease to exist.

Peter: 2020 was a weird year for every photographer. Weddings got moved, sales slowed, inquiries dried up. So you joined the program. Then what happened?

Tom: It took me a little time to grasp everything, because there's a lot of content. But I started following all the advice and protocols in the training videos. One big thing was changing my daily routine and getting in the habit of doing new things every day, especially after leaving a job I'd had for nine years. Every day I'd wake up and think, "What am I doing today? Am I at the winery? Am I doing photography? Am I doing business stuff?" There was no set routine. Setting a routine the way you have us do it let me focus my energy on making new connections and potentially turning those people into clients, or networking through them to other potential clients. I've reconnected with a lot of people too, like vendors, venues and wedding planners.

Peter: Why do you think a routine is important?

Tom: It builds habits, hopefully good ones. There are plenty of bad habits out there. I've noticed it's given me more discipline too. Following the same routine every day starts to embed success into you, and eventually that just becomes the way you are.

Peter: Well said. Aristotle said we are what we repeatedly do. Excellence is a habit. And sometimes there's a lag between the work and the results, especially when you're starting over after a pandemic and leaving a job.

Tom: That was difficult to understand and accept, because we're so conditioned to immediate gratification. When you're messaging with someone on Facebook, you've got them in the moment and you want to book it right now. But that's not how the program works, and it's not how people work. You have to be patient, let it work for you and follow the steps.

Peter: What are you doing now to set up opportunities to book clients?

Tom: Reaching out to people on Facebook and trying to be helpful, whether they need a photographer or not. I join different groups and message people I've connected with over the last couple of months. If someone is looking for a venue in a certain area with a certain style, I'll send them a message: "These are great places to check out. By the way, here's a sample gallery from a wedding I shot there." And I respond differently to different people's needs.

Peter: You're being proactive, going out and creating opportunities. Is that new compared to what you did before?

Tom: Absolutely, and it feels really weird at first. But I'm a firm believer that the good you put out comes back to you. If you think positive thoughts, positivity comes to you. The same thing happens here. If you're proactive about finding leads, the leads will come to you. I've had pretty good success the last couple of weeks, and it's about staying on top of it and keeping the momentum going.

Peter: It might sound a little woo-woo, but it's very practical. People are drawn to people who are happy and helpful. You said this felt uncomfortable at first. How did you get over that?

Tom: Over time, as you do it again and again, you discover what kind of script works and which phrases or questions get a better response. Then those responses turn into organic conversations. You have to assume you're lucky if someone gets back to you, and if they do, it's probably because they looked at your profile and want to talk. Even if they don't need a photographer, you're doing something good for someone else. We need a lot more people doing good things right now. There's so much negativity going around. If I put a little positivity out there, who knows what happens? It gets more natural the more you do it. It's like going to a party for your spouse's coworker where you don't know anyone. You're uncomfortable at first, then someone likes your jacket, and five people later you're talking to everybody.

Peter: I think of Facebook and Instagram as a big party. You walk up and start talking to people, but you don't say, "Hey, buy my thing," because people would think you're insane. You just say, "We have some mutual connections and interests. I wanted to connect and maybe help." For the most part, people appreciate it.

Peter: Let's get into your results. You've had an awesome month.

Tom: This month started out great, and it's ending great. In early October, I photographed a proposal. A guy reached out through a mutual friend to photograph his proposal to his girlfriend at a winery up here, and I helped him coordinate the whole thing. There was a lot of back and forth, and we executed it, and she said yes. Right after that, I started getting a bunch of inquiries, mostly organic. One came from someone on Facebook I'd just started chatting with one day, and she ended up booking. Four more came right after that, and I booked all of them within two weeks. Shortly after those five, I closed two more. One of them was the proposal couple.

Tom: During their engagement session, I asked whether they'd already talked about the wedding. Sometimes people going into a proposal already have an idea of the venue. They said they were thinking about Mexico, and I said, "I want to do that." They loved their proposal and engagement photos, and we all got along great. So they reached back out, and they set a date for December 2021, just north of Cancún, in Playa del Carmen. It took a bit of back and forth, but I'm going to Mexico. They're covering my travel and a couple of nights at the hotel, and still paying my wedding fee. I get paid to shoot and come back with some awesome portfolio work. Altogether, I booked seven weddings in three weeks this month, about $16,600 collected and about $19,000 in sales.

Peter: Wait, you collected $16,600 up front? So a lot of couples are paying in full?

Tom: Out of the seven, four paid in full.

Peter: How are you doing that?

Tom: I take $200 off the total if they pay in full, just as an incentive. That's it. It can be a bargaining chip too. If a couple is hesitant, or they have someone else in mind who's $100 or $200 cheaper, I'll ask, "If you pay in full, would you be open to this price instead?" Often they'll say yes.

Peter: So that's how you handle the objection when someone says they're talking to other photographers?

Tom: I'll use it, but it's my backup offer. First I try to sweeten the deal with service, something that won't really cost me anything, like showing up for an hour of their rehearsal dinner. But money is always their first concern, so they'll take the discount for sure.

Peter: You said the sales process has been one of the biggest game changers. Tell me more.

Tom: In the past, before I was going out on Facebook to find people, I knew that if I could get an inquiry on the phone, I could book them. That started to change over the last year or year and a half. I was having trouble closing, and that was one of the biggest things I wanted out of your program. So far, it's paying off. I could talk to somebody for an hour and think, "I've got this one in the bag." Then I'd end the call by asking, "When would you like to make a decision?" They'd say, "Over the weekend," or "In the next couple of days," and I'd say, "Great. If you have any follow-up questions, shoot me a text or give me a call." Then I wouldn't hear back. A week later I'd email, "Just checking in," and they'd say, "Oh, we went with somebody else." That really changed after working with you. I did eight consultations in two weeks, which isn't a huge number for a lot of people in your program, but I closed seven.

Peter: That's really good.

Tom: It all comes down to the last couple of minutes on the phone. "When do you want to book somebody? Can I be that person? If you need time to think about it, how does Tuesday at 6:30 sound for a follow-up call or Zoom meeting? You can clear your heads over the weekend and have your own conversation, and we'll see where you're at on Tuesday." Then I put it on the calendar and send them an invite right away. That's really helped.

Peter: You're fighting for the deal, not in a desperate way, but they can see you want the business. Most people don't do that. It's easier to say, "Okay, you want to think about it." I heard someone describe it as wilting like a little flower as soon as you get an objection. Then the couple books someone else, and the photographer says, "See, another one ghosted me."

Tom: I've been guilty of that. Your program has changed my confidence. I used to walk around the topic of money. Maybe it's because my family never talked about money growing up. Now I try to be as transparent as I can on the phone, and I encourage people to talk about it: "Is my package too high? Yes or no? We don't have to sugarcoat it. Let's talk about it honestly." It's a business transaction, but it's also a human one, because I'm here to help. Digging deeper into their concerns about cost has changed my thinking and helped a lot.

Peter: How did you get more confidence?

Tom: Part of it is that I don't have the second job anymore, so I have to bring this in. But it's also wanting that success. Every time you book a wedding, there's a rush, and that energy carries into everything else you do, especially when you're on a roll like seven weddings in three weeks. That's the result of momentum building and building.

Peter: When you get to the end of the call, how do you talk about price?

Tom: I'm upfront. "My price for the package you need is $3,400. If that fits for you, I'd love to move forward." Depending on how they react, I might offer $200 off if they pay in full. I also remind them they're not just buying my photography. They're buying into me. By the time their wedding comes next year, we'll have had so many interactions, hopefully an engagement session or at least a coffee, that we'll be friends, and they'll be so comfortable they won't think twice about a camera in their face. I'll keep them on track with the timeline, and I'll be sensitive if they have a minor meltdown at some point. Last night I had a call where I was ready to hang up, and I could tell she was too. Then she mentioned something, and I ended up screen-sharing three galleries that fit her style, and we talked for another 20 minutes. She's already booked.

Peter: What I'm hearing is that you genuinely invest in people. So many creatives are put off by sales, because our culture teaches us that salespeople are bad. But fundamentally, sales is connecting with people heart to heart and helping them get what they want.

Tom: And it doesn't always have to be money. You can offer to add a second shooter, anything that shows you want to work with them because you like them and think you'd have a good time together. When you show that human side, it works.

Peter: For a $3,000 to $5,000 purchase, it's logic and emotion. People say, "It just felt right." You're tailoring your offer so it's the perfect fit.

Tom: One bride from my October bookings is a great example. Our call was supposed to be 10 minutes and turned into 45. We really got into her style, the kind of editing she likes and where the wedding is. They live in South Carolina and are getting married here in Michigan, at a venue she's never seen, though her mom has. It's one of my favorite places to shoot, so I set up a Zoom call. She'd told me they like dark and moody, and they want candid shots of family and friends at the reception. So I pulled images from that same venue that checked every box on their list. On the Zoom call, I went through each one, and at the end, they booked on the spot. I would never have dreamt of doing that before working with you.

Peter: Most photographers don't even get on the phone. You showed her exactly how you'd give her what she wants. That's how people book on the spot.

Peter: Say a photographer is listening who wants to take their business to the next level, maybe quit their job and go full-time, or make $20,000 in a month, but they're on the fence about joining. What would you say?

Tom: Just do it. If you're being held back by another job, where you live or any other struggle, you won't see results until you start putting in the work. I'm a big mountain biker, and there's a saying on the trail, which I'll clean up: commit, or you'll crash. It's how you build the confidence to attack a challenging section where you might get hurt. It applies to life in general. If you don't fully commit to what you want to succeed at, you'll never reach your goals. Do your research. If you're worried about whether this is legitimate or how you'll respond to the program, reach out to people in it and ask about their experience and struggles. I did that before working with Peter. I talked to several people in the group, and they all said the same thing: "I'm killing it right now," making $20,000, $30,000, $40,000 a month. That was enough for me. It's changed not just my finances but how I do business.

Peter: Did seeing other people succeed inspire you?

Tom: Absolutely. You find out what's worked for them and what isn't working anymore. It's great to have the community to ask questions and share your own wins.

Peter: Last question. What's your number one piece of advice for other members of Next Level?

Tom: Persist. That was my biggest hurdle at the beginning. When I started the training videos, I wanted results immediately. I wanted to book $20,000 that month, and that's not going to happen unless you have unlimited time to go through all the content and set everything up. Work at your own pace and let your pace work for you. Don't go too fast or too slow, but stay persistent, and you'll see results when you do the work.

Peter: You don't always see it right away. Then it's a windfall, like this month: you booked over $20,000 in sales, collected cash up front, booked a destination wedding in Mexico and quit your job. All the goals we talked about a couple of months ago are happening, from the work you did last month.

Tom: Every day is different. Some days you have a ton of conversations on Facebook, and some days nobody gets back to you. You get through the tough days by putting yourself into the work.

Peter: What helps you on those days?

Tom: If I can, I get outside and go for a walk to clear my head, and remind myself that this is how business works. It's not personal. Some days you're flooded with people who want to talk, and other days it's crickets. Just know that's going to happen, and you'll get through it. I think you say that in the videos, and thinking back on it really helps.

Peter: If someone wants to hire you for a session or a wedding, how can they reach you?

Tom: My website is twotwistedtrees.com, and I'm on Facebook and Instagram as Two Twisted Trees.

Peter: Thanks for hopping on, Tom. This is just the beginning for you.

Tom: Thanks, Peter. It's been awesome so far, and I can't wait to keep it going.